Zaino and Duragloss--Separated at Birth?

[Setec Astronomy]

Well, Dwayne wanted to get this forum going again...and nothing brings in posts and page views like a Zaino thread!!

Since I don`t think Sal can find out where I live, and my knees are shot already...I`m going out on a limb to say...NO, Zaino and Duragloss are not the same...but YES, they ARE related somehow...there are just too many coincidences for them NOT to be. (I hope you people who think this is blasphemy will read the conclusions before blasting me.)

Before anybody suggests I`m Zaino bashing, I`m NOT--I have plenty of Zaino and it beads like no other and is certainly the longest-lasting sealant I have ever tried. My experience with it is a little weird, because I bought it some years ago to use on a new car of a family member that I don`t get to work on that often (because it was supposed to be the best/most durable), so I pretty much use it only on that car, and that car has gotten only Zaino since new. Some of the Zaino products I have are not the newest versions.

So on to the body of circumstantial evidence...

They both call their sealants "polishes"...how quaint...and something no one else does.

They both had a "polish bonding agent", Z-1 and 601. They both worked the same way, applied before the "polish", allowed to haze, then apply the "polish" right on top of that. Both to improve the durability and the gloss.

Their "polishes"/sealants are both easy off, don`t stain trim, and they both have different flavors that are tuned slightly differently (Z-AIO, Z-2, Z-5 vs. 501, 101, 105, 111, 151). Many of the "polishes" from both companies are sold in 8oz bottles, which is unusual for sealants, while the newer products (Z-AIO and 105) are in 16 oz bottles.

Leather treatments--the packaging is identical except for the bottle color. I have the Zaino conditioner and the DG cleaner, so I can`t compare them directly, but many people have said they are very similar.

QD`s...I have Z-6 and Fast Clean & Shine (921)...I can`t tell them apart, they are the same color, they smell the same, they work the same.

Spray Sealants--Z-8 and Aquawax...these really seem to be almost identical except the Z-8 seems to be much more concentrated.

Tire dressing...I have the old Z-16 that is a thin white liquid that smells like lemons and lasts a long time...I recently got a bottle of the DG 253 Tire & Rubber Dressing which is a thin white liquid that smells like lemons and people say it lasts a long time.

Car wash...both 901 and Z-7 are highly concentrated and suds well...901 "shines as it cleans" and Z-7 will "enhance the gloss"...many people have found these products to be similar. Both great washes.

Microfiber towels...some years ago there was a lot of fanfare about the Zaino Blonde towels...which were unique. I have some and they are different than any other towel I have. Then one day I was browsing the DG site and saw they had some MF`s...so I bought one:



One of those is the Zaino Blonde...one of them is a DG 9003 towel...are they the same? No, they are not. But they are similar, and similarly different to any other towels I`m familiar with. Both very expensive, BTW. And the DG towel DOES have a border.

T-shirts...they both sell t-shirts emblazoned with the company logo! Well...maybe that`s not something we should add to the list...

Things that are not the same...

Well, the DG sealants just don`t seem to have the beading or durability of Zaino. Zaino apparently has a new tire dressing that is thicker and blue with a different smell. Z-8 is really a superior product to AW.

Since Zaino is here in NJ, some years ago I set out to settle a dispute at another forum by attempting to visit the Zaino plant. So I drove to the address on their website...and there was no plant, there was no office, there was no sign. The address on the Zaino website is a UPS store. In and of itself, this is meaningless, many boutique suppliers don`t have their own factory. But usually they at least have a location at the address shown on their website. Others have posted in the past that Sal does this to maintain the secrecy of his formulas and manufacturing, and that his manufacturing facility is in a secret desert location, patrolled by security "cammo dudes" in unmarked vehicles...well, I could be mixing that up with some secret airplane story...

So what is the conclusion to be concluded from this string of ill-conceived "facts"?

It could be that Sal is the chemical genius behind Duragloss. Or it could be that Brothers Research is the technical muscle of Zaino. Or it could be somewhere in between. Perhaps Zaino and Duragloss are brothers separated at birth, Zaino went to an Ivy-league school and became a lawyer, and Duragloss went to the vo-tech and has a blue collar job...Zaino is the elite premium product, while Duragloss is the every day, workhorse product. There certainly is a marketing case for both a premium and an affordable product stemming from the same technical base (think Ford/Lincoln, Honda/Acura, Toyota/Lexus, etc.) Once again, I am NOT saying Zaino and Duragloss are the same, or that one makes the products for the other. For me there are just too many odd coincidences, similarities, and joint differences from other products for their not to be some connection. And no, of course I don`t have any proof that there is some connection, just like no one has any proof that there isn`t a connection.

[Concours.John]

I personally have never used Zaino but found this all interesting. Nice post!

[Bunky]

I had contacted Duragloss and asked for a plant tour (they do have a real mfg place) but they denied my request due to confidentiality reasons.

[Mr. Clean]

This is the exact type of post I`ve been looking for from you since your arrival! Thanks for not disappointing!

I toyed with the idea of trying out some of the Zaino products for years, just never took the leap. I like the fact I can run up the road to pick up the DG products as needed. I try not to let my bottle of 901 run empty before picking up my next gallon. Though it is not the only car wash soap I keep around. Yep, I like it, alot. But it is still just car wash soap and I have a problem getting all in a lather (ha!) over a soap product.

Use FC&S too, but like a few () of us here, I have more than my fair share of QDs. For the record, I don`t think that FC&S is any better than several of my other QDs.

AW is crazy easy to use. So easy in fact that durability isn`t really an issue for my personal vehicles and a pleasant add-on (booster) for special clients.

That is the extent of my foray into the DG product line. I really should try the "polishes", but you have to draw the line sometimes and my current containers which serve as organizers are full to overflowing.

[Pats300zx]

Great thread Setec. I have the entire Zaino product line and a ton of Duragloss products. To say that they are so similar is scary. The contreversy will always be there for sure. I agree with Aquawax and Z8. They are so similar but I agree Z8 seems to be more concentrated. Z10 and Duragloss leather...Identical

I don`t care. I love them both but will not be buying anymore Zaino with the results I get from DG.

[jammerz101]

Bravo for this thread!

I will be doing some comparison of my own soon!

[black bart]

Well, Dwayne wanted to get this forum going again...and nothing brings in posts and page views like a Zaino thread!!

Since I don`t think Sal can find out where I live, and my knees are shot already...I`m going out on a limb to say...NO, Zaino and Duragloss are not the same...but YES, they ARE related somehow...there are just too many coincidences for them NOT to be. (I hope you people who think this is blasphemy will read the conclusions before blasting me.)

Before anybody suggests I`m Zaino bashing, I`m NOT--I have plenty of Zaino and it beads like no other and is certainly the longest-lasting sealant I have ever tried. My experience with it is a little weird, because I bought it some years ago to use on a new car of a family member that I don`t get to work on that often (because it was supposed to be the best/most durable), so I pretty much use it only on that car, and that car has gotten only Zaino since new. Some of the Zaino products I have are not the newest versions.

So on to the body of circumstantial evidence...

They both call their sealants "polishes"...how quaint...and something no one else does.

They both had a "polish bonding agent", Z-1 and 601. They both worked the same way, applied before the "polish", allowed to haze, then apply the "polish" right on top of that. Both to improve the durability and the gloss.

Their "polishes"/sealants are both easy off, don`t stain trim, and they both have different flavors that are tuned slightly differently (Z-AIO, Z-2, Z-5 vs. 501, 101, 105, 111, 151). Many of the "polishes" from both companies are sold in 8oz bottles, which is unusual for sealants, while the newer products (Z-AIO and 105) are in 16 oz bottles.

Leather treatments--the packaging is identical except for the bottle color. I have the Zaino conditioner and the DG cleaner, so I can`t compare them directly, but many people have said they are very similar.

QD`s...I have Z-6 and Fast Clean & Shine (921)...I can`t tell them apart, they are the same color, they smell the same, they work the same.

Spray Sealants--Z-8 and Aquawax...these really seem to be almost identical except the Z-8 seems to be much more concentrated.

Tire dressing...I have the old Z-16 that is a thin white liquid that smells like lemons and lasts a long time...I recently got a bottle of the DG 253 Tire & Rubber Dressing which is a thin white liquid that smells like lemons and people say it lasts a long time.

Car wash...both 901 and Z-7 are highly concentrated and suds well...901 "shines as it cleans" and Z-7 will "enhance the gloss"...many people have found these products to be similar. Both great washes.

Microfiber towels...some years ago there was a lot of fanfare about the Zaino Blonde towels...which were unique. I have some and they are different than any other towel I have. Then one day I was browsing the DG site and saw they had some MF`s...so I bought one:



One of those is the Zaino Blonde...one of them is a DG 9003 towel...are they the same? No, they are not. But they are similar, and similarly different to any other towels I`m familiar with. Both very expensive, BTW. And the DG towel DOES have a border.

T-shirts...they both sell t-shirts emblazoned with the company logo! Well...maybe that`s not something we should add to the list...

Things that are not the same...

Well, the DG sealants just don`t seem to have the beading or durability of Zaino. Zaino apparently has a new tire dressing that is thicker and blue with a different smell. Z-8 is really a superior product to AW.

Since Zaino is here in NJ, some years ago I set out to settle a dispute at another forum by attempting to visit the Zaino plant. So I drove to the address on their website...and there was no plant, there was no office, there was no sign. The address on the Zaino website is a UPS store. In and of itself, this is meaningless, many boutique suppliers don`t have their own factory. But usually they at least have a location at the address shown on their website. Others have posted in the past that Sal does this to maintain the secrecy of his formulas and manufacturing, and that his manufacturing facility is in a secret desert location, patrolled by security "cammo dudes" in unmarked vehicles...well, I could be mixing that up with some secret airplane story...

So what is the conclusion to be concluded from this string of ill-conceived "facts"?

It could be that Sal is the chemical genius behind Duragloss. Or it could be that Brothers Research is the technical muscle of Zaino. Or it could be somewhere in between. Perhaps Zaino and Duragloss are brothers separated at birth, Zaino went to an Ivy-league school and became a lawyer, and Duragloss went to the vo-tech and has a blue collar job...Zaino is the elite premium product, while Duragloss is the every day, workhorse product. There certainly is a marketing case for both a premium and an affordable product stemming from the same technical base (think Ford/Lincoln, Honda/Acura, Toyota/Lexus, etc.) Once again, I am NOT saying Zaino and Duragloss are the same, or that one makes the products for the other. For me there are just too many odd coincidences, similarities, and joint differences from other products for their not to be some connection. And no, of course I don`t have any proof that there is some connection, just like no one has any proof that there isn`t a connection.

You left out one comparison while they work nearly the same DG cost much less making it a better buy

[Bill D]

Setec,

Here are some photos of the Zaino store in Howell, NJ circa 2003/4. Is it still around?

[Setec Astronomy]

Hi Bill, I`m not sure if Shore Motorsports is still in biz or if they still sell Zaino, I "complained" about not being able to order on the internet and having to drive there, and was told that I could order from the PA distributor (who gives great service, BTW). Therefore I haven`t been to Shore since Z-AIO and Z-CS came out, so I guess that was 2007.

However, Shore Motorsports (the brick and mortar way for NJ residents to buy Zaino) is not the same address as the "ZainoStore" address, which is in fact a box at a UPS Store (formerly Mailboxes, Etc.)

NOTE: For those of you who don`t know, NJ residents are unable to order online from the ZainoStore; I was told this is because of "distributor agreements that predate the internet".

[jammerz101]

To add another twist to the Zaino mystery, they don`t even ship out of New Jersey. Internet orders ship from a warehouse in Kansas.

Why is it coming from Kansas?

[Setec Astronomy]

To add another twist to the Zaino mystery, they don`t even ship out of New Jersey. Internet orders ship from a warehouse in Kansas. Why is it coming from Kansas?

The explanation for that has been that the fulfillment center was located in a central location to facilitate quick/equal delivery to all parts of the country.

[richy]

This debate, as you mentioned, has been ongoing for quite some time with no apparent resolution. I am friends with Jerry Bailey and I asked him straight out about this. I have no reason to suspect his answer was anything but truthful, and if you know Jerry, you know he is a pious man. That being said, his answer is that there are very few raw material suppliers that supply the "base stock" that goes into the sealants and products. He suggested that the same supplier would ultimately end up with products with similar characteristics. I used Zaino years ago prior to switching to the DG line. I agree that there are several products with similar characteristics between the 2 lines. The bottom line is does it really matter? DG products are hands down the best value in detailing supplies as far as I`m concerned.

[jammerz101]

This debate, as you mentioned, has been ongoing for quite some time with no apparent resolution. I am friends with Jerry Bailey and I asked him straight out about this. I have no reason to suspect his answer was anything but truthful, and if you know Jerry, you know he is a pious man.

Not questioning his honesty or integrity at all but do you really think that IF there was a private label agreement in place that he would disclose private business information to you so you could go and post it online?

I`m not suggesting that such an agreement is in place, but let`s be realistic with our expectations of what information is available to us.

[Larry A]

I talked with Jerry at D.G. once and he said that I could order his sealant with a change , that is a product with more sealant in it or more cleaner or less cleaner in it .Maybe thats what Sal did, when he started he just had D.G. make there 101 cleaner sealant without the cleaner. Chemical Guys will do the same thing, tweek the formula a little if you pay the price.

[Beemerboy]

Excellent article and very interesting finds.