Problem with hazy clearcoat

[Antym15]

Hi folks, here`s a question for anyone expereinced in painting or hardcore detailing... yea right.



I`ve got a couple of problem spots on my car after applying clearcoat to cover up some serious, and I mean serious scratches. Well, 95% of what I touched up looks excellent if I do say so myself. I was very careful to wetsand, progressively getting finer... up to 2000 grit sandpaper. Then I heavy-cut compounded (very light), fine-cut, and then IHG... wax came later after 3 months curing time. Occassionally I used rubbing alcohol to help in the cutting process.



Most, 95% of what I did looks excellent... no probs. But I have 2 very small areas of where it still appears to look slightly hazy. One area is on my bumper and measure 2" by 8" inches and the other is an area on my hood measuring roughly 1.5" by 2" inches. I tried re-doing my steps, only this time by hand and not using my random orbital polisher, and only going to fine cut compound (3M perfect-It 2), then IHG, and wax, but to no avail.



Should I try adding alcohol to my process with the fine cut compound and using the machine (yellow foam pad). Then switch to wool pad, then finnally IHG?



Also, how do I know I didn`t go through the clearcoat? Do i get a magnifying glass?



I dunno... I need help! Thanks!

[Lemonxxs]

Can you post a pic?



There is a device out there called a 30X magnifier sold by radio shack and can be used to look at the clear coat.



Do I understand correctly that you blended the clear coat on some panels to hide a scratch?

[Bobby G]

I have a few questions:



1. Did you spray clear to the whole car or just a touch-up area?



2. Why did you apply a new clear coat? I understand scratches...



3. Why are you using alcohol?



4. Why was it necessary to wet sand?



Just to give you some background information, it is very difficult to apply a new clear coat to a car. I really does not work very well. Most paints require a primer coat to layer up from. The clear coat is applied almost immediately after a color coat, and bonds to the color coat, which bonds to the primer.



If you have clouding in the color coat, I suspect it is a chemical problem between the cured paint and the new clear coat. No amount of sanding or rubbing will fix the problem.



db

[Antym15]

Yes, I only blended in clear coat over some very nasty scratches that wouldn`t go away after exhausting many, many hours and tactics.



In fact, I believe I may have damaged the clear coat in my intial attempts to fix the scratces since I overworked the surface. So I ended up clear coating only a few very small areas. Not all of the areas look bad where I sprayed, only two very small areas. I didn`t touch the paint/pigment layers. Also David, this clouding only started to recently show up, or become more obvious recently.



Additional clear coat was necessary after wearing down clear coat (see above).



Wet sanding was needed to remove Orange Peel... a textural effect that happens right after painting.



A mixture of alcohol and water was used in glazing, I thought this was popular? Albeit not the norm. It sometimes helps in promoting a nice glaze.



I can`t post pics at the moment, I`ll try to take pics from my 35mm and scan them in and upload them, etc., etc... this could take a while.



I`ll check out that magnifying glass from Radio Shack... thanks!

[BradE]

Clearcoat has a "spungy" layer that can be exposed if you remove more than .3 mil of clear. This layer is very porus and will, over time, absorb water and other things. Thus giving it a cloudy, milky, appearance.



Sounds to me like you removed too much clear during wetsanding and exposed the spungy layer. There is no fix for this, repaint time.



It`s also possible the clear you re-sprayed with detach from the surface down the road.

[Antym15]

Thanks Showroom...

That`s exactly what I am afraid of.

But before I re-paint I want to give it one last shot so... let`s just say, hypothetically speaking, that the clearcoat isn`t damaged (it really doesn`t look all that bad). And it`s just a very slight hazy look. Should I just repeat my steps from say... glazing? I guess what I`m really asking is... what would YOU do... besides painting to bring it back, what method(s) would you use? It actually did look good for at least a month after spraying, but only recently after rubbing some IHG on the areas did they slightly start to get hazy... I wouldn`t say cloudy. So, after they became hazy, I tried a little 3M Perfect-It Fine Rubbing compund by hand... but this only started to make it worse, so I stoped. And that`s where I am at right now. I feel like I`m missing a step, oir that I should be doing something slightly different. I need someone elses professional point of view before I resort to re-spray.



Any more insight, would be greatly appreciated, thanks!



Colin:

[Antym15]

OK folks, here`s where we stand. I did not get a magnifying glass. And i wish I took “before� pic`s... but oh well.



Basically I changed my method...

Go to this link and see what I suggested this person use for orange peel.

This worked great removing the haze, and even a bit of the factory orange peel. Initially, I was too agressive in my past attempts. But what I think really helped was using water during compounding (medium/light compound), just enough to get the pad nice and damp. And then keeping it damp during each intitial application of compound. The compound would eventually dry up and I would very lightly work in the dust, which I think really did the glazing. And the introduction of an additional step including 3M SMR. Before, I was afraid to work in too much of the duct, out of fear of scratching. Also, before I was using way too much product and keeping it wet.



The results? The back bumper portion of haze is completely gone and about 90% of what was on the hood is now completely gone. Actually during my first couple of passes of compounding it started to reveal haze in a little more of the surrounding areas. Again, I`d like to stress that the haze was minimal, and you could only see it on a bright day, on the right angle, yadda, yadda. So... I still need to go back and touch up, but it`s VERY minmal. I was actually able to go over some hardcore scratches I found on the car while in the process of fixing the haze, and it worked phenominally well!

:bounce



I also want to thank everyone here... I stayed online for hours and kept on reading past posts about methods folks have used!!! And basically I gleaned information from someone else who methods I employed, only difference is in the brands, but the products are very similar. :xyxthumbs



Also, I have a Craftsman random orbit polisher/buffer, with a fixed speed of 4,000 RPM. SO, I was ever mindful not to burn the paint. But it`s the high speed that really provided the glazing action that I needed.



here`s that thread with the methods I used:

http://autopia.ws/forums/showthread....threadid=13877

[BradE]

Mix up some car wash and water solution in the spray bottle and use that for your sanding water. I still think you have probably removed way too much clear. If this car is a daily driver don`t expect the clearcoat (which has been wet sanded) to last very long, the UV blockers concentrate in the top .5 mil. If you remove too much, which I suspect you have due to the clouding, the clear might only last a few years.

[Antym15]

Perhaps, but I hope you`re wrong Showroom!

Thanks for your concern. I could have indeed very easily have gone through that layer. What can I look for with the magnifying glass to tell me if I went too far?



If it does indeed start to cloud, it should probably only take about 3 months I`m guessing to start to show up. We`ll see, at that point in time I should be getting ready for my Winter wax & prep. If I learned anything... it`s that I didn`t recognize the signs and I will need to repaint... that would be a paint in the a$$ for sure. Only time will tell. :p



Colin